ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟
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قديمي 02-17-2018   #1 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟
طبق این داده ، آیا سلاطین عثمانی اصالت پدری ایرانی داشته اند و فارس بوده اند؟


ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟



در مورد نتانیاهو نیز ظاهرا جد پدری اش ایرانی بوده است لکن یهودیت از طریق مادری منتقل می شود.



آیا اینها اصالت پدری ایرانی داشته اند؟
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امام علی (ع) : قضاوتی که با تکیه به ظن و گمان باشد، عادلانه نیست/ متهم تا با بینه ،حد بر او اثبات نشود، بی گناه شمرده می شود/ در حال خشم هرگز داورى مکن.

چه گوارا: برای فرستادن افراد به جایگاه تیرباران به اثبات قضایی نیازی نیست… این‌‌ها روش‌های پیش پا افتاده بورژوایی هستند. این یک انقلاب است ! و یک انقلابی می‌بایست به یک ماشین کشتار سرد تبدیل شود
!:

ويرايش توسط enkidu : 02-17-2018 در ساعت 02:12 PM
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

پارس ها قوم قدیمی ترک بوده اند همانند ماد وپارت اقلیت تاجیکی در زمان سامانیان به ایران مهاجرت کرده و زبان دری را به ترکهای مناطق مرکزی ایران انتقال داده اند
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قديمي 02-18-2018   #3 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

جناب اینکیدو نشان دادند که خیلی ژن و ژنتیک واقعا دوست میدارند و هر باره موضوعی برای ان طرح میکند تا "نژاد ایرانی" مردمان چین و عرب و ترک و آفریقا و آمریکا و یهود و مسیح و ... را به اثبات برسانند
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قديمي 02-18-2018   #4 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

یهودیان اروپای شرقی عمدتا از تبار خزرها هستند . مارکرهای یافت شده در مقبره خزر ها از نوع R1a-z93 می باشد .
R1a-z93 یکی از مارکرهای فراوان موجود در اقوام ترک است .
اکثر اقوام ایرانی زبان مانند فارس ها ، لر ها ، اوستیایی ها چنین مارکری را خیلی کم دارا می باشند ، فقط تاجیک های سغد درصد بالایی از این مارکر را دارند.
معلوم نیست استارتر از کجا به چنین نتیجه ای رسیده است !!!
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ويرايش توسط stivi : 02-18-2018 در ساعت 08:22 AM
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قديمي 02-18-2018   #5 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله ozlam نمايش نوشته ها
جناب اینکیدو نشان دادند که خیلی ژن و ژنتیک واقعا دوست میدارند و هر باره موضوعی برای ان طرح میکند تا "نژاد ایرانی" مردمان چین و عرب و ترک و آفریقا و آمریکا و یهود و مسیح و ... را به اثبات برسانند
بله چون ژنتیک رسوا کننده پان ترکان نادان و گستاخ است
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله stivi نمايش نوشته ها
یهودیان اروپای شرقی عمدتا از تبار خزرها هستند . مارکرهای یافت شده در مقبره خزر ها از نوع R1a-z93 می باشد .
R1a-z93 یکی از مارکرهای فراوان موجود در اقوام ترک است .
اکثر اقوام ایرانی زبان مانند فارس ها ، لر ها ، اوستیایی ها چنین مارکری را خیلی کم دارا می باشند ، فقط تاجیک های سغد درصد بالایی از این مارکر را دارند.
معلوم نیست استارتر از کجا به چنین نتیجه ای رسیده است !!!
این هم از ادعاهای پان ترکی است که حساب و کتاب ندارد.

ادعاهای شما خلاف داده های علمی است ، r1a با کد z 93 را همه محافل علمی بهنوان هاپلوگروپ هندو و ایرانی می شناسند

حالا شما قصد دارید ان را ترکی کنید فقط جنبه طنز دارد.
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قديمي 02-18-2018   #7 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله enkidu نمايش نوشته ها
این هم از ادعاهای پان ترکی است که حساب و کتاب ندارد.

ادعاهای شما خلاف داده های علمی است ، r1a با کد z 93 را همه محافل علمی بهنوان هاپلوگروپ هندو و ایرانی می شناسند

حالا شما قصد دارید ان را ترکی کنید فقط جنبه طنز دارد.
اقوامی که شما هند و ایرانی می خوانید به لحاظ ژنتیکی هیچ ارتباطی بهم ندارند .
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قديمي 02-18-2018   #8 (لینک نوشته)
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله stivi نمايش نوشته ها
اقوامی که شما هند و ایرانی می خوانید به لحاظ ژنتیکی هیچ ارتباطی بهم ندارند .

ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

علم خلاف ادعاهای شما را می گوید.
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

History of R1a

The Germanic branch
The first major expansion of R1a took place with the westward propagation of the Corded Ware (or Battle Axe) culture (2800-1800 BCE) from the northern forest-steppe in the Yamna homeland. This was the first wave of R1a into Europe, the one that brought the Z283 subclade to Germany and the Netherlands, and Z284 to Scandinavia. The Corded Ware R1a people would have mixed with the pre-Germanic I1 and I2 aborigines, which resulted in the first Indo-European culture in Germany and Scandinavia, although that culture could not be considered Proto-Germanic - it was simply Proto-Indo-European at that stage, or perhaps or Proto-Balto-Slavic.

Germanic languages probably did not appear before the Nordic Bronze Age (1800-500 BCE). Proto-Germanic language probably developed as a blend of two branches of Indo-European languages, namely the Proto-Balto-Slavic language of the Corded-Ware culture (R1a-Z283) and the later arrival of Proto-Italo-Celto-Germanic people from the Unetice culture (R1b-L11). This is supported by the fact that Germanic people are a R1a-R1b hybrid, that these two haplogroups came via separate routes at different times, and that Proto-Germanic language is closest to Proto-Italo-Celtic, but also shares similarities with Proto-Slavic.

The R1b branch of the Indo-Europeans is thought to have originated in the southern Yamna culture (northern shores of the Black Sea). It was the first one to move from the steppes to Europe, invading the Danube delta around 4200 BCE, then making its way around the Balkans and the Hungarian plain in the 4th millennium BCE. It is likely that a minority of R1a people accompanied this R1b migration. Those R1a men would have belonged to the L664 subclade, the first to split from the Yamna core. These early steppe invaders were not a homogeneous group, but a cluster of tribes. It is possible that the R1a-L664 people were one or several separate tribes of their own, or that they mixed with some R1b lineages, notably R1b-U106, which would become the main Germanic lineage many centuries later. The R1b-R1a contingent moved up the Danube to the Panonian plain around 2800 BCE, brought to an end the local Bell Beaker (circa 2200 BCE) and Corded Ware (c. 2400 BCE) cultures in Central Europe, and set up the Unetice culture (2300-1600 BCE) around Bohemia and eastern Germany. Unetice can be seen as the source of future Germanic, Celtic and Italic cultures, and is associated with the L11 subclade of R1b.

The late Unetice culture expanded to Scandinavia, founding the Nordic Bronze Age. R1a-L664 and R1b (L11 and U106) presumably reached Scandinavia at this time. People from the Nordic Bronze Age probably spoke a Proto-Germanic language, which for over a thousand years acquired vocabulary from the indigenous Corded Ware language, itself a mixture of Proto-Balto-Slavic and non-IE pre-Germanic. The first genuine Germanic tongue has been estimated by linguists to have come into existence around (or after) 500 BCE, just as the Nordic Bronze Age came to an end, giving way to the Pre-Roman Iron Age. The uniqueness of some of the Germanic vocabulary points at borrowing from native pre-Indo-European languages (Germanic substrate theory). The Celtic language itself is known to have borrowed from Afro-Asiatic languages spoken by Near-Eastern immigrants to Central Europe. The fact that present-day Scandinavia is composed of roughly 40% of I1, 20% of R1a and 40% of R1b reinforces the idea that the Germanic ethnicity and language had acquired a tri-hybrid character by the Iron Age.


The Slavic branch
The origins of the Slavs go back to circa 3500 BCE with the northern Yamna culture and its expansion across Central and Northeast Europe with the Corded Ware culture. The M458 and Z280 lineages spread around Poland, Belarus, Ukraine and western Russia, and would form the core of the Proto-Balto-Slavic culture. The high prevalence of R1a in Balto-Slavic countries nowadays is not only due to the Corded Ware expansion, but also to a long succession of later migrations from Russia, the last of which took place from the 5th to the 10th century CE. The Slavic branch differentiated itself when the Corded Ware culture absorbed the Cucuteni-Tripolye culture (5200-2600 BCE) of western Ukraine and north-eastern Romania, which appears to have been composed primarily of I2a1b (M423) lineages descended directly from Paleolithic Europeans, with a small admixture of Near-Eastern immigrants (notably E1b1b, G2a, J and T). Thus emerged the hybrid Globular Amphora culture (3400-2800 BCE) in what is now Ukraine, Belarus and Poland. It is surely during this period that I2a2, E-V13 and T spread (along with R1a) around Poland, Belarus and western Russia, explaining why eastern and northern Slavs (and Lithuanians) have between 10 and 20% of I2a1b lineages and about 10% of Middle Eastern lineages (18% for Ukrainians). After just a few centuries, this hybridised culture faded away into the dominant Corded Ware (2800-1800 BCE) and Catacomb (2800-1800 BCE) cultures.

The Corded Ware period was followed in the steppes by the Srubna culture (1800-1200 BCE), and around Poland by the Trzciniec culture (1700-1200 BCE).

The last important Slavic migration is thought to have happened in the 6th century CE, from Ukraine to Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia, filling the vacuum left by eastern Germanic tribes who invaded the Roman Empire. Both the M458 and the Z280 branches are associated with this late Slavic migration, but more particularly Z280.

Interestingly, the Czechs do not carry much Z280, a factor that strongly differentiates them from their Slovak, Hungarian and Slovene neighbours. Czechs R1a belongs in majority to M458, with subclades such as L1029>YP1703 (TMRCA 1800 years), L260>YP256>YP654 (TMRCA 2200 years), L260>YP256>YP254>Y2905 (TMRCA 1850 years) and L260>YP1337 (TMRCA 1750 years). Other R1a clades found in the Czech Republic include Z280>Y35>CTS3402>YP237>YP951 (TMRCA 2500 years) CTS1211>Y35>YP4278 (TMRCA 1850 years), some Z92 and Z93, as well as the Germanic L664 (S3479>S3485>S3477>YP942; TMRCA 1800 years). The age of these subclades concord with the historical Slavic expansion during the Late Antiquity and Early Middle Ages.

Regional disparities also exist in ex-Yugoslavia, but among deeper clades. Bosnian and Serbian R1a belongs for the most part to a young clade of CTS1211 (Y33>CTS8816>Y3300>Y5647>YP611>YP3987>YP3992 subclade; TMRCA 950 years), with a minority of older M458 (CTS11962>L1029 subclade; TMRCA 2200 years) and Z92 (Y4459>YP617 subclade; TMRCA 3400 years). Croatian R1a falls almost exclusively within CTS1211, but to another clade (Y35>CTS3402>Y2613>Y2608 subclade, TMRCA 1950 years), with a small minority of YP340>P278.2 (TMRCA 2100 years). The R1a-Y3300 (aka L1280) found in Serbia and Bosnia seems to have expanded from Poland via Hungary during the early medieval period. The Croatian R1a-Y2608 also expanded from Poland during the same period, but via Czechia, Slovakia, Austria and Slovenia.

Bulgarian R1a is very diverse in comparison to Dinaric R1a. Subclades equally divided between M458 (mostly the pan-Slavic L1029 subclade) and Z280, but with a huge diversity within the latter, (Y33>CTS8816, YP237>YP235>L366, YP343>YP39082>YP340, Z92>YP617 and Z92>Z685). There is also a little bit of very old R1a-M198 (M417-), and some R1a-Z93, notably the Y15121 subclade found in Iran, India and the Middle East, and which could have come with the Scythians or other Iranic steppe tribes. Little data is available for neighbouring Macedonia, but it includes at least L1029 (under M458) and L366 (under CTS1211).

Romanians have an even greater diversity of R1a clades than Bulgarians, despite not being speakers of a Slavic language. In fact, not all Romanian R1a is of Slavic origin. It includes Germanic clades (L664>S2894>YP285>YP282 and Z283), Iranian ones (Z93) and Jewish ones (CTS6). The Slavic clades represented include L1029 (under M458>CTS11962) and YP951 (under CTS1211>Y35>CTS3402>YP237>).

Historically, no other part of Europe was invaded a higher number of times by steppe peoples than the Balkans. Chronologically, the first R1a invaders might have come with the westward expansion of the Sredny Stog culture (from 4200 BCE), which led the way to a succession of steppe migrations that lasted for over 2,000 years until the end of the Yamna culture (3500-2000 BCE). These early invasions from the Steppe were probably conducted in majority by R1b men, accompanied by a small number of R1a. Then came the Thracians (1500 BCE), followed by the Illyrians (around 1200 BCE), and much later the Huns and the Alans (400 CE), the Avars, the Bulgars and the Serbs (all around 600 CE), and the Magyars (900 CE), among others. These peoples originated from different parts of the Eurasian Steppe, anywhere between Eastern Europe and Central Asia, thus contributing to the relatively high diversity of R1a subclades observed in Carpathians and the Balkans today, especially in Bulgaria and Romania. Nevertheless, the vast majority of R1a in Southeast Europe today appears to be of Slavic origin.


The Baltic branch
The Baltic branch is thought to have evolved from the Fatyanovo culture (3200-2300 BCE), the northeastern extension of the Corded Ware culture. Early Bronze Age R1a nomads from the northern steppes and forest-steppes would have mixed with the Uralic-speaking inhabitants (N1c1 lineages) of the region. This is supported by a strong presence of both R1a and N1c1 haplogroups from southern Finland to Lithuania and in northwest Russia.

Latvian and Lithuanian clades of R1a include typical Balto-Slavic lineages like M458, CTS1211 and Z92, as well as some Ashkenazi Jewish (CTS6), Germanic (L664 and Z284) and even Indo-Iranian lineages (Z93>Z94>L657). The Balto-Slavic lineages include the following deep clades, most with a relatively recent TMRCA.


The Indo-Iranian branch

Proto-Indo-Iranian speakers, the people who later called themselves 'Aryans' in the Rig Veda and the Avesta, originated in the Sintashta-Petrovka culture (2100-1750 BCE), in the Tobol and Ishim valleys, east of the Ural Mountains. It was founded by pastoralist nomads from the Abashevo culture (2500-1900 BCE), ranging from the upper Don-Volga to the Ural Mountains, and the Poltavka culture (2700-2100 BCE), extending from the lower Don-Volga to the Caspian depression.

The Sintashta-Petrovka culture, associated with R1a-Z93 and its subclades, was the first Bronze Age advance of the Indo-Europeans west of the Urals, opening the way to the vast plains and deserts of Central Asia to the metal-rich Altai mountains. The Aryans quickly expanded over all Central Asia, from the shores of the Caspian to southern Siberia and the Tian Shan, through trading, seasonal herd migrations, and looting raids.

Horse-drawn war chariots seem to have been invented by Sintashta people around 2100 BCE, and quickly spread to the mining region of Bactria-Margiana (modern border of Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan and Afghanistan). Copper had been extracted intensively in the Urals, and the Proto-Indo-Iranians from Sintashta-Petrovka were exporting it in huge quantities to the Middle East. They appear to have been attracted by the natural resources of the Zeravshan valley for a Petrovka copper-mining colony was established in Tugai around 1900 BCE, and tin was extracted soon afterwards at Karnab and Mushiston. Tin was an especially valued resource in the late Bronze Age, when weapons were made of copper-tin alloy, stronger than the more primitive arsenical bronze. In the 1700's BCE, the Indo-Iranians expanded to the lower Amu Darya valley and settled in irrigation farming communities (Tazabagyab culture). By 1600 BCE, the old fortified towns of Margiana-Bactria were abandoned, submerged by the northern steppe migrants. The group of Central Asian cultures under Indo-Iranian influence is known as the Andronovo horizon, and lasted until 800 BCE.

The Indo-Iranian migrations progressed further south across the Hindu Kush. By 1700 BCE, horse-riding pastoralists had penetrated into Balochistan (south-west Pakistan). The Indus valley succumbed circa 1500 BCE, and the northern and central parts of the Indian subcontinent were taken over by 500 BCE. Westward migrations led Old Indic Sanskrit speakers riding war chariots to Assyria, where they became the Mitanni rulers from circa 1500 BCE. The Medes, Parthians and Persians, all Iranian speakers from the Andronovo culture, moved into the Iranian plateau from 800 BCE. Those that stayed in Central Asia are remembered by history as the Scythians, while the Yamna descendants who remained in the Pontic-Caspian steppe became known as the Sarmatians to the ancient Greeks and Romans.

The Indo-Iranian migrations have resulted in high R1a frequencies in southern Central Asia, Iran and the Indian subcontinent. The highest frequency of R1a (about 65%) is reached in a cluster around Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and northern Afghanistan. In India and Pakistan, R1a ranges from 15 to 50% of the population, depending on the region, ethnic group and caste. R1a is generally stronger is the North-West of the subcontinent, and weakest in the Dravidian-speaking South (Tamil Nadu, Kerala, Karnataka, Andhra Pradesh) and from Bengal eastward. Over 70% of the Brahmins (highest caste in Hindusim) belong to R1a1, due to a founder effect.

Maternal lineages in South Asia are, however, overwhelmingly pre-Indo-European. For instance, India has over 75% of "native" mtDNA M and R lineages and 10% of East Asian lineages. In the residual 15% of haplogroups, approximately half are of Middle Eastern origin. Only about 7 or 8% could be of "Russian" (Pontic-Caspian steppe) origin, mostly in the form of haplogroup U2 and W (although the origin of U2 is still debated). European mtDNA lineages are much more common in Central Asia though, and even in Afghanistan and northern Pakistan. This suggests that the Indo-European invasion of India was conducted mostly by men through war, and the first major settlement of women was in northern Pakistan, western India (Punjab to Gujarat) and northern India (Uttar Pradesh), where haplogroups U2 and W are the most common.
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

History of R1a

The Germanic branch
The first major expansion of R1a took place with the westward propagation of the Corded Ware (or Battle Axe) culture (2800-1800 BCE) from the northern forest-steppe in the Yamna homeland. This was the first wave of R1a into Europe, the one that brought the Z283 subclade to Germany and the Netherlands, and Z284 to Scandinavia. The Corded Ware R1a people would have mixed with the pre-Germanic I1 and I2 aborigines, which resulted in the first Indo-European culture in Germany and Scandinavia, although that culture could not be considered Proto-Germanic - it was simply Proto-Indo-European at that stage, or perhaps or Proto-Balto-Slavic.

Germanic languages probably did not appear before the Nordic Bronze Age (1800-500 BCE). Proto-Germanic language probably developed as a blend of two branches of Indo-European languages, namely the Proto-Balto-Slavic language of the Corded-Ware culture (R1a-Z283) and the later arrival of Proto-Italo-Celto-Germanic people from the Unetice culture (R1b-L11). This is supported by the fact that Germanic people are a R1a-R1b hybrid, that these two haplogroups came via separate routes at different times, and that Proto-Germanic language is closest to Proto-Italo-Celtic, but also shares similarities with Proto-Slavic.

The R1b branch of the Indo-Europeans is thought to have originated in the southern Yamna culture (northern shores of the Black Sea). It was the first one to move from the steppes to Europe, invading the Danube delta around 4200 BCE, then making its way around the Balkans and the Hungarian plain in the 4th millennium BCE. It is likely that a minority of R1a people accompanied this R1b migration. Those R1a men would have belonged to the L664 subclade, the first to split from the Yamna core. These early steppe invaders were not a homogeneous group, but a cluster of tribes. It is possible that the R1a-L664 people were one or several separate tribes of their own, or that they mixed with some R1b lineages, notably R1b-U106, which would become the main Germanic lineage many centuries later. The R1b-R1a contingent moved up the Danube to the Panonian plain around 2800 BCE, brought to an end the local Bell Beaker (circa 2200 BCE) and Corded Ware (c. 2400 BCE) cultures in Central Europe, and set up the Unetice culture (2300-1600 BCE) around Bohemia and eastern Germany. Unetice can be seen as the source of future Germanic, Celtic and Italic cultures, and is associated with the L11 subclade of R1b.

The late Unetice culture expanded to Scandinavia, founding the Nordic Bronze Age. R1a-L664 and R1b (L11 and U106) presumably reached Scandinavia at this time. People from the Nordic Bronze Age probably spoke a Proto-Germanic language, which for over a thousand years acquired vocabulary from the indigenous Corded Ware language, itself a mixture of Proto-Balto-Slavic and non-IE pre-Germanic. The first genuine Germanic tongue has been estimated by linguists to have come into existence around (or after) 500 BCE, just as the Nordic Bronze Age came to an end, giving way to the Pre-Roman Iron Age. The uniqueness of some of the Germanic vocabulary points at borrowing from native pre-Indo-European languages (Germanic substrate theory). The Celtic language itself is known to have borrowed from Afro-Asiatic languages spoken by Near-Eastern immigrants to Central Europe. The fact that present-day Scandinavia is composed of roughly 40% of I1, 20% of R1a and 40% of R1b reinforces the idea that the Germanic ethnicity and language had acquired a tri-hybrid character by the Iron Age.


The Slavic branch
The origins of the Slavs go back to circa 3500 BCE with the northern Yamna culture and its expansion across Central and Northeast Europe with the Corded Ware culture. The M458 and Z280 lineages spread around Poland, Belarus, Ukraine and western Russia, and would form the core of the Proto-Balto-Slavic culture. The high prevalence of R1a in Balto-Slavic countries nowadays is not only due to the Corded Ware expansion, but also to a long succession of later migrations from Russia, the last of which took place from the 5th to the 10th century CE. The Slavic branch differentiated itself when the Corded Ware culture absorbed the Cucuteni-Tripolye culture (5200-2600 BCE) of western Ukraine and north-eastern Romania, which appears to have been composed primarily of I2a1b (M423) lineages descended directly from Paleolithic Europeans, with a small admixture of Near-Eastern immigrants (notably E1b1b, G2a, J and T). Thus emerged the hybrid Globular Amphora culture (3400-2800 BCE) in what is now Ukraine, Belarus and Poland. It is surely during this period that I2a2, E-V13 and T spread (along with R1a) around Poland, Belarus and western Russia, explaining why eastern and northern Slavs (and Lithuanians) have between 10 and 20% of I2a1b lineages and about 10% of Middle Eastern lineages (18% for Ukrainians). After just a few centuries, this hybridised culture faded away into the dominant Corded Ware (2800-1800 BCE) and Catacomb (2800-1800 BCE) cultures.

The Corded Ware period was followed in the steppes by the Srubna culture (1800-1200 BCE), and around Poland by the Trzciniec culture (1700-1200 BCE).

The last important Slavic migration is thought to have happened in the 6th century CE, from Ukraine to Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia, filling the vacuum left by eastern Germanic tribes who invaded the Roman Empire. Both the M458 and the Z280 branches are associated with this late Slavic migration, but more particularly Z280.

Interestingly, the Czechs do not carry much Z280, a factor that strongly differentiates them from their Slovak, Hungarian and Slovene neighbours. Czechs R1a belongs in majority to M458, with subclades such as L1029>YP1703 (TMRCA 1800 years), L260>YP256>YP654 (TMRCA 2200 years), L260>YP256>YP254>Y2905 (TMRCA 1850 years) and L260>YP1337 (TMRCA 1750 years). Other R1a clades found in the Czech Republic include Z280>Y35>CTS3402>YP237>YP951 (TMRCA 2500 years) CTS1211>Y35>YP4278 (TMRCA 1850 years), some Z92 and Z93, as well as the Germanic L664 (S3479>S3485>S3477>YP942; TMRCA 1800 years). The age of these subclades concord with the historical Slavic expansion during the Late Antiquity and Early Middle Ages.

Regional disparities also exist in ex-Yugoslavia, but among deeper clades. Bosnian and Serbian R1a belongs for the most part to a young clade of CTS1211 (Y33>CTS8816>Y3300>Y5647>YP611>YP3987>YP3992 subclade; TMRCA 950 years), with a minority of older M458 (CTS11962>L1029 subclade; TMRCA 2200 years) and Z92 (Y4459>YP617 subclade; TMRCA 3400 years). Croatian R1a falls almost exclusively within CTS1211, but to another clade (Y35>CTS3402>Y2613>Y2608 subclade, TMRCA 1950 years), with a small minority of YP340>P278.2 (TMRCA 2100 years). The R1a-Y3300 (aka L1280) found in Serbia and Bosnia seems to have expanded from Poland via Hungary during the early medieval period. The Croatian R1a-Y2608 also expanded from Poland during the same period, but via Czechia, Slovakia, Austria and Slovenia.

Bulgarian R1a is very diverse in comparison to Dinaric R1a. Subclades equally divided between M458 (mostly the pan-Slavic L1029 subclade) and Z280, but with a huge diversity within the latter, (Y33>CTS8816, YP237>YP235>L366, YP343>YP39082>YP340, Z92>YP617 and Z92>Z685). There is also a little bit of very old R1a-M198 (M417-), and some R1a-Z93, notably the Y15121 subclade found in Iran, India and the Middle East, and which could have come with the Scythians or other Iranic steppe tribes. Little data is available for neighbouring Macedonia, but it includes at least L1029 (under M458) and L366 (under CTS1211).

Romanians have an even greater diversity of R1a clades than Bulgarians, despite not being speakers of a Slavic language. In fact, not all Romanian R1a is of Slavic origin. It includes Germanic clades (L664>S2894>YP285>YP282 and Z283), Iranian ones (Z93) and Jewish ones (CTS6). The Slavic clades represented include L1029 (under M458>CTS11962) and YP951 (under CTS1211>Y35>CTS3402>YP237>).

Historically, no other part of Europe was invaded a higher number of times by steppe peoples than the Balkans. Chronologically, the first R1a invaders might have come with the westward expansion of the Sredny Stog culture (from 4200 BCE), which led the way to a succession of steppe migrations that lasted for over 2,000 years until the end of the Yamna culture (3500-2000 BCE). These early invasions from the Steppe were probably conducted in majority by R1b men, accompanied by a small number of R1a. Then came the Thracians (1500 BCE), followed by the Illyrians (around 1200 BCE), and much later the Huns and the Alans (400 CE), the Avars, the Bulgars and the Serbs (all around 600 CE), and the Magyars (900 CE), among others. These peoples originated from different parts of the Eurasian Steppe, anywhere between Eastern Europe and Central Asia, thus contributing to the relatively high diversity of R1a subclades observed in Carpathians and the Balkans today, especially in Bulgaria and Romania. Nevertheless, the vast majority of R1a in Southeast Europe today appears to be of Slavic origin.


The Baltic branch
The Baltic branch is thought to have evolved from the Fatyanovo culture (3200-2300 BCE), the northeastern extension of the Corded Ware culture. Early Bronze Age R1a nomads from the northern steppes and forest-steppes would have mixed with the Uralic-speaking inhabitants (N1c1 lineages) of the region. This is supported by a strong presence of both R1a and N1c1 haplogroups from southern Finland to Lithuania and in northwest Russia.

Latvian and Lithuanian clades of R1a include typical Balto-Slavic lineages like M458, CTS1211 and Z92, as well as some Ashkenazi Jewish (CTS6), Germanic (L664 and Z284) and even Indo-Iranian lineages (Z93>Z94>L657). The Balto-Slavic lineages include the following deep clades, most with a relatively recent TMRCA.


The Indo-Iranian branch

Proto-Indo-Iranian speakers, the people who later called themselves 'Aryans' in the Rig Veda and the Avesta, originated in the Sintashta-Petrovka culture (2100-1750 BCE), in the Tobol and Ishim valleys, east of the Ural Mountains. It was founded by pastoralist nomads from the Abashevo culture (2500-1900 BCE), ranging from the upper Don-Volga to the Ural Mountains, and the Poltavka culture (2700-2100 BCE), extending from the lower Don-Volga to the Caspian depression.

The Sintashta-Petrovka culture, associated with R1a-Z93 and its subclades, was the first Bronze Age advance of the Indo-Europeans west of the Urals, opening the way to the vast plains and deserts of Central Asia to the metal-rich Altai mountains. The Aryans quickly expanded over all Central Asia, from the shores of the Caspian to southern Siberia and the Tian Shan, through trading, seasonal herd migrations, and looting raids.

Horse-drawn war chariots seem to have been invented by Sintashta people around 2100 BCE, and quickly spread to the mining region of Bactria-Margiana (modern border of Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan and Afghanistan). Copper had been extracted intensively in the Urals, and the Proto-Indo-Iranians from Sintashta-Petrovka were exporting it in huge quantities to the Middle East. They appear to have been attracted by the natural resources of the Zeravshan valley for a Petrovka copper-mining colony was established in Tugai around 1900 BCE, and tin was extracted soon afterwards at Karnab and Mushiston. Tin was an especially valued resource in the late Bronze Age, when weapons were made of copper-tin alloy, stronger than the more primitive arsenical bronze. In the 1700's BCE, the Indo-Iranians expanded to the lower Amu Darya valley and settled in irrigation farming communities (Tazabagyab culture). By 1600 BCE, the old fortified towns of Margiana-Bactria were abandoned, submerged by the northern steppe migrants. The group of Central Asian cultures under Indo-Iranian influence is known as the Andronovo horizon, and lasted until 800 BCE.

The Indo-Iranian migrations progressed further south across the Hindu Kush. By 1700 BCE, horse-riding pastoralists had penetrated into Balochistan (south-west Pakistan). The Indus valley succumbed circa 1500 BCE, and the northern and central parts of the Indian subcontinent were taken over by 500 BCE. Westward migrations led Old Indic Sanskrit speakers riding war chariots to Assyria, where they became the Mitanni rulers from circa 1500 BCE. The Medes, Parthians and Persians, all Iranian speakers from the Andronovo culture, moved into the Iranian plateau from 800 BCE. Those that stayed in Central Asia are remembered by history as the Scythians, while the Yamna descendants who remained in the Pontic-Caspian steppe became known as the Sarmatians to the ancient Greeks and Romans.

The Indo-Iranian migrations have resulted in high R1a frequencies in southern Central Asia, Iran and the Indian subcontinent. The highest frequency of R1a (about 65%) is reached in a cluster around Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and northern Afghanistan. In India and Pakistan, R1a ranges from 15 to 50% of the population, depending on the region, ethnic group and caste. R1a is generally stronger is the North-West of the subcontinent, and weakest in the Dravidian-speaking South (Tamil Nadu, Kerala, Karnataka, Andhra Pradesh) and from Bengal eastward. Over 70% of the Brahmins (highest caste in Hindusim) belong to R1a1, due to a founder effect.

Maternal lineages in South Asia are, however, overwhelmingly pre-Indo-European. For instance, India has over 75% of "native" mtDNA M and R lineages and 10% of East Asian lineages. In the residual 15% of haplogroups, approximately half are of Middle Eastern origin. Only about 7 or 8% could be of "Russian" (Pontic-Caspian steppe) origin, mostly in the form of haplogroup U2 and W (although the origin of U2 is still debated). European mtDNA lineages are much more common in Central Asia though, and even in Afghanistan and northern Pakistan. This suggests that the Indo-European invasion of India was conducted mostly by men through war, and the first major settlement of women was in northern Pakistan, western India (Punjab to Gujarat) and northern India (Uttar Pradesh), where haplogroups U2 and W are the most common.
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplo...1a_Y-DNA.shtml
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

منظور من از اقوام هند و ایرانی ، اقوام فعلی میباشد نه اقوام چند هزار سال قبل .
این تحقیق بیشتر روی مردم اروپا تمرکز کرده و نشاندهنده تنوع و تفاوت این مارکر در آنهاست.
همچنین این تحقیق اگر درست باشد نشان میدهد که اکثریت مردم ایران ، هند و ایرانی نیستند چون حداکثر بطور متوسط ده تا بیست درصد این مارکر را دارند .
مارکر غالب مردم ایران j و e می باشد که مختص خاورمیانه و شمال آفریقاست.
با این تفسیر باید پذیرفت که اقوام ترکی مانند قرقیز ، اویغور ، باشقورد ، ازبک ، آلتای و ... خیلی بیشتر از مردم ایران ، هندوایرانی هستند !!!!!!
و باز شما در اینجا به نقطه اولتان برمی گردید.
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله stivi نمايش نوشته ها
منظور من از اقوام هند و ایرانی ، اقوام فعلی میباشد نه اقوام چند هزار سال قبل .
این تحقیق بیشتر روی مردم اروپا تمرکز کرده و نشاندهنده تنوع و تفاوت این مارکر در آنهاست.
همچنین این تحقیق اگر درست باشد نشان میدهد که اکثریت مردم ایران ، هند و ایرانی نیستند چون حداکثر بطور متوسط ده تا بیست درصد این مارکر را دارند .
مارکر غالب مردم ایران j و e می باشد که مختص خاورمیانه و شمال آفریقاست.
با این تفسیر باید پذیرفت که اقوام ترکی مانند قرقیز ، اویغور ، باشقورد ، ازبک ، آلتای و ... خیلی بیشتر از مردم ایران ، هندوایرانی هستند !!!!!!
و باز شما در اینجا به نقطه اولتان برمی گردید.
اولا که موصوع بحث سلاطین عثمانی هستند که زنتیک می گوید هند و اروپایی هستند نه تورک

ثانیا عمده کسانی که به اشتباه به انها می گویید تورک، مارکرهای j و r1a دارند پس نژاد تورک بی نژاد تورک.
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

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اولا که موصوع بحث سلاطین عثمانی هستند که زنتیک می گوید هند و اروپایی هستند نه تورک

ثانیا عمده کسانی که به اشتباه به انها می گویید تورک، مارکرهای j و r1a دارند پس نژاد تورک بی نژاد تورک.
نظر شما صد در صد غلط می باشد.
چون اولا مقادیر مارکرهای r1a و r1b در اقوام ترک عمدتا بیشتر از اقوام هند و اروپایی است .
در بین اقوام هند و اروپایی هم این مارکر ها در مناطقی که سکونتگاه سنتی ترکان بودند و یا ترکان به آن مناطق کوچیده اند بیشتر دیده می شوند . مثلا در هند در مناطقی که ترکان و مغولان به آنجا کوچیده اند بیشتر است یا در افغانستان در بین پشتون ها که نیمی از آنها غلزایی یعنی خلج هستند بیشتر دیده می شود .
در اروپای شرقی هم مناطقی که مقصد هون ها و تاتار ها و خزر ها بودند بیشتر دیده می شود .
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پيش فرض پاسخ : ژنتیک: آیا سلاطین عثمانی ایرانی تبار بوده اند؟

نوشته اصلي بوسيله stivi نمايش نوشته ها
نظر شما صد در صد غلط می باشد.
چون اولا مقادیر مارکرهای r1a و r1b در اقوام ترک عمدتا بیشتر از اقوام هند و اروپایی است .
در بین اقوام هند و اروپایی هم این مارکر ها در مناطقی که سکونتگاه سنتی ترکان بودند و یا ترکان به آن مناطق کوچیده اند بیشتر دیده می شوند . مثلا در هند در مناطقی که ترکان و مغولان به آنجا کوچیده اند بیشتر است یا در افغانستان در بین پشتون ها که نیمی از آنها غلزایی یعنی خلج هستند بیشتر دیده می شود .
در اروپای شرقی هم مناطقی که مقصد هون ها و تاتار ها و خزر ها بودند بیشتر دیده می شود .

مثلا با این تفسیر شما درصد بالایی از المانی ها و اتریشی ها و دانمارک و اسلواکی و روس و همه ترک هستند یکمرتبه به جای هندو اروپایی ، مصطلح کنید ترک و اروپایی!

اگر ترکها r1a و r1bدارند پس ترک نیستند هندو اروپایی هستند.

بهتر است نگاهی به ژنتیک قزاق ها و مغولها بیاندازید.

کسانی که امروز ترک خوانده می شوند عمدتا هندو اروپایی هایی هستند که با زبان های مختلف ترکی صحبت می کنند. که ان زبانها هم درصد بالایی از عربی و فارسی بهره گرفته است.
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